Supreme Court decisions

[andylicious]

do you acknowledge more than two sexes outside of Humans ?

Do you acknowledge there are 100's of different species of birds, mammals, fishes , reptiles, amphibians and insects that engage in homosexual and bisexual behavior ?

Do you acknowledge God as the Divine creator of those species ?

Of course there are hermaphroditic species, species that change sexes, and all kinds of strange things that happen but they aren’t human. Applying other animal species life cycles and methods of survival to humans is not valid. If that’s the case do you crap out of your mouth or just rub one out in the bath tub to float around in order to get a woman pregnant?

Please don’t use the sad argument “we ain’t nothing but mammals let’s do it like they do it on the animal channel?”

Of course God is the Divine Creator

 

[CowboyJD]

Of course God is the Divine Creator

Prove that objectively and factually.

 

[JTOSU]

Prove that objectively and factually.

I assume I am probably in the lowest decile of being religious on this board, but that is questioning someone’s faith.

 

[andylicious]

Prove that objectively and factually.

Prove its not true

 

[Polds4OSU]

Of course there are hermaphroditic species, species that change sexes, and all kinds of strange things that happen but they aren’t human. Applying other animal species life cycles and methods of survival to humans is not valid. If that’s the case do you crap out of your mouth or just rub one out in the bath tub to float around in order to get a woman pregnant?

Please don’t use the sad argument “we ain’t nothing but mammals let’s do it like they do it on the animal channel?”

Of course God is the Divine Creator

So then homosexuality, sex changing, hermaphroditism, multiple types of sexes outside of male/female, bisexual and homosexual relationships are all Divine in their inspiration and creation......in the animal kingdom.

Since this is of God's divine creation these are NOT sins, until they are adopted by Humans and then and only then they become sins correct?

Because God didn't create sin in his Creation. is it not a fallacy to call all homosexuality a sin ? because I don't think you could call it that given that God created it in many creatures and species.

Homosexuality as a stand alone idea can not be considered a sin in the animal kingdom which would make the following statement true for all life on Earth?

Homosexuals are sinners but not all homosexuals are sinners (which for the love of all mental gymnastics this makes perfect sense to some people)

 

[GratefulPoke]

I’m not convinced by your arguments because you are twisting reality to what your bias is. I don’t have a divinity degree but I do have a degree in chemistry, biology and two masters one in education and one in biology. I have also been trained in order to teach Sunday School and adult training classes. Do you want my resume?

Here’s what I do know:
I know there’s only two sexes in humans
I know the men of Sodom wanted to get it on with two angels that appeared as male.
Male to Male sex is homosexual sex.
Sodom got burned to the ground for evil living

Your authority in this area is no greater than mine. Your interpretations are flawed, mine may be as well.

1) You do realize that the very same can be said for you, right? One of us tried to overplay their expertise on this issue, do you remember who did that? Just own your error: you appealed to authority when you didn't have it in the first place. I was happy to debate facts regardless of qualification and still am.
2) Your statement is verifiably false. There are more than two biological sexes in humans. There are male, female and intersex people. The latter group is a very small minority--anywhere between .018% to 1.7% of the population depending on ones definition of what constitutes someone who is intersex. This variance is based on prevalence and function of physiological and genital features. (Source: https://www.jstor.org/stable/3813612)
3) My challenge was the use of the genesis passage to support one male one female marriage. That is an eisegetical reading of the passage--period. The author of Genesis is not concerned with the concept of marriage--not culturally, not legally not anything. Its a creation story. For the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, the text isn't super clear. One thing is for certain is that reading ones own point of view into that passage happens both ways, and the stronger evidence points toward what @Polds4OSU cited. FWIW, I do think that Paul directly condemns homosexuality in the NT. My counter to that is that the Bible is not a reliable or consistent source of ethics: sexual or otherwise. If one believes in biblical inerrancy, we are taking about a literal genocidal God. I'm happy to provide references if you want them.

 

[GratefulPoke]

Prove its not true

Do the same for the flying spaghetti monster.

Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster – The world's fastest growing religion

www.spaghettimonster.org

 

[andylicious]

Do the same for the flying spaghetti monster.

Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster – The world's fastest growing religion

www.spaghettimonster.org

She’s Woolley, a great Oklahoman, wrote about the one eyed one horned flying purple eater. I would never question Sheb Woolley

 

[Polds4OSU]

1) You do realize that the very same can be said for you, right? One of us tried to overplay their expertise on this issue, do you remember who did that? Just own your error: you appealed to authority when you didn't have it in the first place. I was happy to debate facts regardless of qualification and still am.
2) Your statement is verifiably false. There are more than two biological sexes in humans. There are male, female and intersex people. The latter group is a very small minority--anywhere between .018% to 1.7% of the population depending on ones definition of what constitutes someone who is intersex. This variance is based on prevalence and function of physiological and genital features. (Source: https://www.jstor.org/stable/3813612)
3) My challenge was the use of the genesis passage to support one male one female marriage. That is an eisegetical reading of the passage--period. The author of Genesis is not concerned with the concept of marriage--not culturally, not legally not anything. Its a creation story. For the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, the text isn't super clear. One thing is for certain is that reading ones own point of view into that passage happens both ways, and the stronger evidence points toward what @Polds4OSU cited. FWIW, I do think that Paul directly condemns homosexuality in the NT. My counter to that is to say that the Bible is not a reliable or consistent source of ethics: sexual or otherwise. If one believes in biblical inerrancy, we are taking about a literal genocidal God. I'm happy to provide references if you want them.

intersex and hermaphroditism does occur in Humans like you pointed out at a rate of 1.7%

Yet 5% of all diagnosed cases of Gender Identity issues that occur in humans are born with intersex or hermaphroditism. Seems there MAY be some relationship there.

God doesn't make mistakes and by his own Divine creation, the other species of the Earth God created with this Intersex ability have 100's of examples of those species engaging in bisexual and homosexual relationships etc. Yet they want to ignore this and claim it is only part of the Animal Kingdom......In their view..despite it being very real and easy to prove as reality for Humans as well as other species on the planet. They want to ignore this Divine creation in God's own Image of Humans, in which many (Millions and millions of humans) over the entire creation have been born of a 3rd sex and can exhibit traits and characteristics, hormone production, reproductive organs etc of both sexes naturally.

 

[andylicious]

1) You do realize that the very same can be said for you, right? One of us tried to overplay their expertise on this issue, do you remember who did that? Just own your error: you appealed to authority when you didn't have it in the first place. I was happy to debate facts regardless of qualification and still am.
2) Your statement is verifiably false. There are more than two biological sexes in humans. There are male, female and intersex people. The latter group is a very small minority--anywhere between .018% to 1.7% of the population depending on ones definition of what constitutes someone who is intersex. This variance is based on prevalence and function of physiological and genital features. (Source: https://www.jstor.org/stable/3813612)
3) My challenge was the use of the genesis passage to support one male one female marriage. That is an eisegetical reading of the passage--period. The author of Genesis is not concerned with the concept of marriage--not culturally, not legally not anything. Its a creation story. For the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, the text isn't super clear. One thing is for certain is that reading ones own point of view into that passage happens both ways, and the stronger evidence points toward what @Polds4OSU cited. FWIW, I do think that Paul directly condemns homosexuality in the NT. My counter to that is that the Bible is not a reliable or consistent source of ethics: sexual or otherwise. If one believes in biblical inerrancy, we are taking about a literal genocidal God. I'm happy to provide references if you want them.

I didn’t appeal to anyone’s authority. My statement was “they went the Vatican to read the original files, that wasn’t good enough so they went to the Dead Sea to find previously unread scrolls. Now if you did those things I still believe you are wrong.

You seem like a good guy, but you aren’t going to change my mind.

Work your own beliefs out with fear and trembling, I will worry about mine.

 

[Vakarian74]

I assume I am probably in the lowest decile of being religious on this board, but that is questioning someone’s faith.

Why the F@&k is it not ok to question someone’s faith but it’s alright for you and them to disparage a large group of people. Not very Christ like if you ask me.

 

[andylicious]

intersex and hermaphroditism does occur in Humans like you pointed out at a rate of 1.7%

Yet 5% of all diagnosed cases of Gender Identity issues that occur in humans are born with intersex or hermaphroditism. Seems there MAY be some relationship there.

God doesn't make mistakes and by his own Divine creation, the other species of the Earth God created with this Intersex ability have 100's of examples of those species engaging in bisexual and homosexual relationshipsetc. Yet they want to ignore this

There was once a belief that the Y promoting factor could cause an issue this. Several major studies refuted this belief in the 1990’s and early 2000’s. The whole idea of intersex is a social science construct.

 

[Polds4OSU]

There was once a belief that the Y promoting factor could cause an issue this. Several major studies refuted this belief in the 1990’s and early 2000’s. The whole idea of intersex is a social science construct.

Are seriously trying to suggest that Human Social constructs can change God's perfect Creation of his own image?

You do realize that intersex humans have been recorded throughout history right ..the term hermaphrodite is actually coined after the God Hermaphroditus from Ancient Rome who was androgynous and represented intersex people of Rome.

Ancient Islam called them Khuntha
Ancient Greek physician Galen wrote about them as he examined them
Christians leaders in the Middle Ages used to refer to them as "Abnormals"
They discovered the Grave of an intersex Finnish person that dated back to 1050 in 2021 and detailed in in the European Journal of Archeology. The person was buried with full male and female ritualistic items
Ancient Jewish peoples used to refer to intersex people as tumtum and they held traditional male and female roles in their society

 

[PF5]

 

[GratefulPoke]

I assume I am probably in the lowest decile of being religious on this board, but that is questioning someone’s faith.

I'm curious: Do you believe there is some issue with politely questioning someone's faith or lack of faith?

 

[GratefulPoke]

I didn’t appeal to anyone’s authority. My statement was “they went the Vatican to read the original files, that wasn’t good enough so they went to the Dead Sea to find previously unread scrolls. Now if you did those things I still believe you are wrong.

You seem like a good guy, but you aren’t going to change my mind.

Work your own beliefs out with fear and trembling, I will worry about mine.

I appreciate your honesty. I did and it is one of several reasons I am non-theist at this point.

 

[JTOSU]

Why the F@&k is it not ok to question someone’s faith but it’s alright for you and them to disparage a large group of people. Not very Christ like if you ask me.

Who have I disparaged? And when?

 

[Vakarian74]

Who have I disparaged? And when?

You didn’t answer my question.

 

[GOGETUMPOKE]

1) You do realize that the very same can be said for you, right? One of us tried to overplay their expertise on this issue, do you remember who did that? Just own your error: you appealed to authority when you didn't have it in the first place. I was happy to debate facts regardless of qualification and still am.
2) Your statement is verifiably false. There are more than two biological sexes in humans. There are male, female and intersex people. The latter group is a very small minority--anywhere between .018% to 1.7% of the population depending on ones definition of what constitutes someone who is intersex. This variance is based on prevalence and function of physiological and genital features. (Source: https://www.jstor.org/stable/3813612)
3) My challenge was the use of the genesis passage to support one male one female marriage. That is an eisegetical reading of the passage--period. The author of Genesis is not concerned with the concept of marriage--not culturally, not legally not anything. Its a creation story. For the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, the text isn't super clear. One thing is for certain is that reading ones own point of view into that passage happens both ways, and the stronger evidence points toward what @Polds4OSU cited. FWIW, I do think that Paul directly condemns homosexuality in the NT. My counter to that is that the Bible is not a reliable or consistent source of ethics: sexual or otherwise. If one believes in biblical inerrancy, we are taking about a literal genocidal God. I'm happy to provide references if you want them.

If you don’t believe in God why not just end the argument there? Just say there is no God and be done with it. My, and several others, problem with homosexuality is obviously based on our Christian faith and confidence in his word that you obviously don’t share and our opinions are mute from the get go. For those that claim to be Christian but want to twist the scriptures to allow for their sin it’s a completely different argument.

 

[CowboyJD]

Prove its not true

I can’t.

I’ve said so in this thread.

BUT….

You’re the one that said “Of course God is the Divine Creator”.

If it’s that obvious and evident as you proclaim, you should be able to prove it objectively and factually.

And…..you can’t. Nobody can.

That’s why it’s called faith.

I just want to see if you will acknowledge that very simple fact.

I bet you won’t.