What a year

[orngblkzebra]

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[Functianalyst]

I've never called for a single coach to be fired.

I've commented throughout the season positively, multiple times, about the team's turnaround.

Every single team is trying to gel each season.

Not really sure how a comment about 3 losses by large margins being a bad thing is controversial.

Both things can be true, and obviously are: we failed miserably and weren't competitive at all in 3 of our games, but the coaching staff and players still deserve alot of credit for not allowing the Iowa State loss and being 2-2 to derail the season. I said that exact thing multiple times in the weeks following that game.

Not criticizing your comments. Just merely pointing out that for a team that was not picked to finish higher than 7th place in the preseason, playing for the conference championship was quite impressive. A 10 win season this year is solely on HCMG, after being decimated by the transfer portal and having to develop OCs. HCMG earned his salary this year, as did other coaches who actually had to coach.

 

[TheMonkey]

I've never called for a single coach to be fired.

I've commented throughout the season positively, multiple times, about the team's turnaround.

Every single team is trying to gel each season.

Not really sure how a comment about 3 losses by large margins being a bad thing is controversial.

Both things can be true, and obviously are: we failed miserably and weren't competitive at all in 3 of our games, but the coaching staff and players still deserve alot of credit for not allowing the Iowa State loss and being 2-2 to derail the season. I said that exact thing multiple times in the weeks following that game.

I think everyone is assuming that your call for “some serious introspection and evaluation of the coaching staff” meant probably firing coaches.

 

[Backin82]

I think everyone is assuming that your call for “some serious introspection and evaluation of the coaching staff” meant probably firing coaches.

I took it to mean "serious introspection and evaluation of the coaching staff". My company does that yearly at a minimum, because we all have room to grow, learn, and improve. If major problems occurred in that year, our introspection and evaluations may be more intense, and rightly so. We can't afford to screw things up, and we have to be really honest about any failures or close calls to protect our operation and the public.

I would like to think a D1 athletic program operates at similar or higher standards than my company, and its weird when people get white knighty when it is expected that they do.

 

[TheMonkey]

I took it to mean "serious introspection and evaluation of the coaching staff". My company does that yearly at a minimum, because we all have room to grow, learn, and improve. If major problems occurred in that year, our introspection and evaluations may be more intense, and rightly so. We can't afford to screw things up, and we have to be really honest about any failures or close calls to protect our operation and the public.

I would like to think a D1 athletic program operates at similar or higher standards than my company, and its weird when people get white knighty when it is expected that they do.

Cool

 

[Osucowboy79]

I took it to mean "serious introspection and evaluation of the coaching staff". My company does that yearly at a minimum, because we all have room to grow, learn, and improve. If major problems occurred in that year, our introspection and evaluations may be more intense, and rightly so. We can't afford to screw things up, and we have to be really honest about any failures or close calls to protect our operation and the public.

I would like to think a D1 athletic program operates at similar or higher standards than my company, and its weird when people get white knighty when it is expected that they do.

Based on the way you talk, I assume your company also discusses your internal business processes publicly and fires people to satisfy the emotions of anonymous message board posters.

I'm sure that's great for morale.

 

[Backin82]

Based on the way you talk, I assume your company also discusses your internal business processes publicly and fires people to satisfy the emotions of anonymous message board posters.

I'm sure that's great for morale.

We aren't an entertainment operation, so no, we don't do that. D1 football is in public view. Its entertainment. Its why the CEO of that operation makes over $7mil/yr, does press conferences, etc...

And we're not discussing firing people to satisfy message board posters. That's purely hyperbole.

We're talking about internal evaluations to figure out what's working, what's not, and how to improve. If that requires people to work harder, learn new things, or in some cases, be let go, so be it. That's the nature of the beast in high-level, competitive sports.

I'm surprised that you or anyone on this board would be upset at such an expectation.

 

[Osucowboy79]

We aren't an entertainment operation, so no, we don't do that. D1 football is in public view. Its entertainment. Its why the CEO of that operation makes over $7mil/yr, does press conferences, etc...

And we're not discussing firing people to satisfy message board posters. That's purely hyperbole.

We're talking about internal evaluations to figure out what's working, what's not, and how to improve. If that requires people to work harder, learn new things, or in some cases, be let go, so be it. That's the nature of the beast in high-level, competitive sports.

I'm surprised that you or anyone on this board would be upset at such an expectation.

I'm curious why you think that doesn't happen. Hell, they revamped the run game this off-season and what do you know, a Doak Walker award winner and a Big 12 championship birth.

Yet still you whine....

 

[TheMonkey]

I'm curious why you think that doesn't happen. Hell, they revamped the run game this off-season and what do you know, a Doak Walker award winner and a Big 12 championship birth.

Yet still you whine....

So Gundy did change? It’s someone else who didn’t? Well, that’s Birry hypocritical of him.

 

[Backin82]

I'm curious why you think that doesn't happen. Hell, they revamped the run game this off-season and what do you know, a Doak Walker award winner and a Big 12 championship birth.

Yet still you whine....

I'm sure it IS happening, which is exactly why I'm making fun of you for bristling at the notion that we expect such evaluations happen.

 

[TheMonkey]

I'm sure it IS happening, which is exactly why I'm making fun of you for bristling at the notion that we expect such evaluations happen.

I'm not willing to go down the rabbit hole with you again. Nor do I want to subject everyone else to that. I will just say this and walk away.

I guess you fancy yourself as some clever contrarian, but you're just manufacturing arguments where there aren't any. @DxCowboy made a statement that I suggested others (not including you, BTW) presumed meant he wanted to see coaches fired. It appeared to imply it, but he clarified that was not his intention.

I think the argument could have ended there. But you had to hop in and Birrysplain how employees are evaluated in business. Thanks for that. If only I knew this information before I helped create a competency management system for a Fortune 50 global enterprise, that included performance evaluations, PIP plans, and other corrective actions.

Look, I think it was a misunderstanding. No one thinks evaluations of the coaching staff are not happening. No one is "bristling" except you.

Let's move on.

 

[Backin82]

I'm not willing to go down the rabbit hole with you again. Nor do I want to subject everyone else to that. I will just say this and walk away.

I guess you fancy yourself as some clever contrarian, but you're just manufacturing arguments where there aren't any. @DxCowboy made a statement that I suggested others (not including you, BTW) presumed meant he wanted to see coaches fired. It appeared to imply it, but he clarified that was not his intention.

I think the argument could have ended there. But you had to hop in and Birrysplain how employees are evaluated in business. Thanks for that. If only I knew this information before I helped create a competency management system for a Fortune 50 global enterprise, that included performance evaluations, PIP plans, and other corrective actions.

Look, I think it was a misunderstanding. No one thinks evaluations of the coaching staff are not happening. No one is "bristling" except you.

Let's move on.

I appreciate the breakdown. Not sure we could have moved on without the Monkeysplaining. Good talk. Moving on...

 

[stonewallpoke]

I'm sure it IS happening, which is exactly why I'm making fun of you for bristling at the notion that we expect such evaluations happen.

If you’re sure it’s happening, then why is that we constantly get posts from you and yours suggesting that it needs to happen? It’s either:

You don’t think they’re doing the most rudimentary principle of athletics (improve to win), and that you or someone else on this board are the only ones with the vision to do so, or..

..you know they’re doing it but seem to want to demonstrate your grasp of basic knowledge AND see your words in print, farming for likes from people essentially nodding along to the equivalent sage advice to of “if it’s cold outside, wear a coat”.

In other words, it’s know-it-all behavior or attention seeking behavior.

 

[Pistol Pete's Mustache]

If you’re sure it’s happening, then why is that we constantly get posts from you and yours suggesting that it needs to happen? It’s either:

You don’t think they’re doing the most rudimentary principle of athletics (improve to win), and that you or someone else on this board are the only ones with the vision to do so, or..

..you know they’re doing it but seem to want to demonstrate your grasp of basic knowledge AND see your words in print, farming for likes from people essentially nodding along to the equivalent sage advice to of “if it’s cold outside, wear a coat”.

In other words, it’s know-it-all behavior or attention seeking behavior.

The staff literally revamped the offense after South Alabama. In one week. And we went on a 5 game tear thereafter. Our weakness for several years has been depth. We lost a ton of it to the portal last year. We're on track to lose very little and to add depth. Next year could be big. And not aggy "wait til next year" but legit reasons to believe next year will be big. Better and deeper OL for Ollie, healthy and deeper WR corp, defense with more depth and experience, etc., etc. This feels like after 2010 when we did good and things looked like the following year would be better and it was. We've been burned a few times since but that's sports. I really feel good about next season assuming we don't have portal losses like last year which all indications are that it won't happen (it would have already happened like last year or like what's going on at aggy).

 

[GratefulPoke]

The staff literally revamped the offense after South Alabama. In one week. And we went on a 5 game tear thereafter. Our weakness for several years has been depth. We lost a ton of it to the portal last year. We're on track to lose very little and to add depth. Next year could be big. And not aggy "wait til next year" but legit reasons to believe next year will be big. Better and deeper OL for Ollie, healthy and deeper WR corp, defense with more depth and experience, etc., etc. This feels like after 2010 when we did good and things looked like the following year would be better and it was. We've been burned a few times since but that's sports. I really feel good about next season assuming we don't have portal losses like last year which all indications are that it won't happen (it would have already happened like last year or like what's going on at aggy).

I also thought this year had some similarities to 2010. We have further to go than that team did though. They also couldn't grab positions of need out of the portal like we can however.

 

[Backin82]

If you’re sure it’s happening, then why is that we constantly get posts from you and yours suggesting that it needs to happen? It’s either:

You don’t think they’re doing the most rudimentary principle of athletics (improve to win), and that you or someone else on this board are the only ones with the vision to do so, or..

..you know they’re doing it but seem to want to demonstrate your grasp of basic knowledge AND see your words in print, farming for likes from people essentially nodding along to the equivalent sage advice to of “if it’s cold outside, wear a coat”.

In other words, it’s know-it-all behavior or attention seeking behavior.

To start, the binary framework you laid out is asinine, so I won't play by those rules. Nice try, but no.
-- I'm not sure its happening all the time, because Gundy is often too comfortable losing games and getting out-coached. I expect our coach to find ways to not get out-coached multiple times per year, and seek changes to improve upon past failures.
-- I'm sure it is happening most of the time, hence our above average record.
-- D1 football is highly competitive, and anyone involved in it will face higher levels of scrutiny than the average Joe. That's the gig. You make millions of dollars a year in a competitive entertainment arena, you get to deal with the pressure and scrutiny of the people who pay your wages.
-- I'm mainly addressing the dummies who try to invalidate any/all criticisms of the coaching staff as if they are infallible (they are not).

As I've said many times - I think Gundy is a good coach, but he has limitations and flaws. He isn't perfect. Not sure why it triggers y'all to discuss such imperfections along with the positives. For some reason you seem to believe that fans aren't allowed to be critical, which just seems insane to me.

I doubt you've read my positive posts this season, because you seem to efficiently filter them out. Below is a summary.
Positives (praiseworthy):
-- I was encouraged by our offensive progression this season. We looked more dynamic, and spread the ball around better than any I've seen in the last decade.
-- I was encouraged to see our season-long resiliency as a team. Much credit to the coaches for this.
-- I have been encouraged to see Gundy get fired up on the sidelines at bad calls. He actually looks like he cares, which believe it or not, matters.
-- We actually looked a little better at managing games and pacing things more appropriately at times.

Negatives (to be criticized):
-- Being completely uncompetitive in 3 games (so far) this season. This is a big one, and seems nearly inexcusable at this level.
-- A few odd play calls sporadically through the year
-- Continued hiring of inexperienced coordinators

 

[Rob B.]

I appreciate the breakdown. Not sure we could have moved on without the Monkeysplaining. Good talk. Moving on...

OMG!

 

[stonewallpoke]

To start, the binary framework you laid out is asinine, so I won't play by those rules. Nice try, but no.
-- I'm not sure its happening all the time, because Gundy is often too comfortable losing games and getting out-coached. I expect our coach to find ways to not get out-coached multiple times per year, and seek changes to improve upon past failures.

I stopped here, except to briefly scan, because it’s hilarious that you’d say my framework is asinine, and then choose both answers.

I did appreciate you calling people “dummies” who think the coaches are “infallible”, because here’s another binary framework for ya:

You are the first to whine, piss and moan whenever you feel you’ve detected an ad hominem attack, yet here you are, unsolicited, throwing names around, and..

..nobody has, at any point in time, on this site or the other, described the coaches as “infallible”, not have they suggested, inferred, or hinted at the same. Never. They have repeatedly pushed back on you (and others) who seem to disappear when things are going good/great, but have a thousand words of spittle-flecked fury to type out when we struggle or lose. Conflating that with assigning infallibility to the coaches is, to borrow one of your $3.75 words, asinine.

 

[CptnQuirk]

I stopped here, except to briefly scan, because it’s hilarious that you’d say my framework is asinine, and then choose both answers.

I did appreciate you calling people “dummies” who think the coaches are “infallible”, because here’s another binary framework for ya:

You are the first to whine, piss and moan whenever you feel you’ve detected an ad hominem attack, yet here you are, unsolicited, throwing names around, and..

..nobody has, at any point in time, on this site or the other, described the coaches as “infallible”, not have they suggested, inferred, or hinted at the same. Never. They have repeatedly pushed back on you (and others) who seem to disappear when things are going good/great, but have a thousand words of spittle-flecked fury to type out when we struggle or lose. Conflating that with assigning infallibility to the coaches is, to borrow one of your $3.75 words, asinine.

Tree-fiddy, not $3.75,

 

[CowboyJD]

Thank god Gundy's more competent than the attorney from the metropolis of Kingfisher.

In your head 24/7.

Rent free.