mugatu
Ranger
Because they make more!!!
They pay lower rates. We don't tax flat rate. Someone making 50k/year shouldn't pay the same as someone making 100mil/year.
US continues to go backward...
- Thread starter PF5
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They pay lower rates. We don't tax flat rate. Someone making 50k/year shouldn't pay the same as someone making 100mil/year.
mugatu
Ranger
Yes he ONLY cares about reducing HIS tax burden and claims that deficit is what's important.
PF5
Ranger
You either don’t understand how the super wealthy avoid paying their share or you’re in denial…bless your heart…
People feel entitled to others people’s money so they can continue spending.
Literally no one is advocating "so they can continue to spend".
People feel entitled to others people’s money so they can continue spending.
Everybody has recognized the need to control and lower spending.
Mischaracterize, mislead, misdirect.
It's all you have.
mugatu
Ranger
Historical Federal Individual Income Tax Rates & Brackets, 1862-2021
How do current federal individual income tax rates and brackets compare historically?
taxfoundation.org
Look at tax rates over the years. It's done nothing but come down. At some point guess what, governments need money to function. Yes spending needs to be curbed but you've also got to raise the amount coming in.
You must not like to accept facts. The Top 1% pay 40% of all income tax revenue. They used to pay 25%.
The average tax rate of the Top 1% is 26%. Nearly 8x higher than the bottom 50% of taxpayers.
At least if you are going to counter-point..stop and use facts. I get your opinion is wealthy people should pay even more…but they pay more than you. In raw dollars and percentage. Stupid silly one-off examples of one-year for a Trump and a Romney just illustrate how much you want to ignore real facts
mugatu
Ranger
They own what percentage of wealth/income right now?
So in your mind if we keep having larger income disparities that means we should keep lowering taxes on the wealthy because they'll otherwise be paying more of the taxes? That's ridiculous.
Compare that chart to top I come tax brackets and annual deficit, notice the 1980s and pair that back to when high income tax cuts started (1982 Top bracket dropped from 70% to 50% and it's just gone more so since then).
They earn 20% of income and pay 40% of all income taxes.
Yeah I think this is where people are getting hung up. You're specifically talking income taxes.
For what it's worth, I think everyone's income tax rate should be 0%.
PF5
Ranger
stats can be deceiving and confusing and twisted...it would take too long to explain the tax system for Americans on this thread, and it wouldn´t matter to people like jtosu anyway...however, there are many forms of federal taxes besides income tax, as well as state and local taxes and when you factor in all taxes and income, it is fairly even proportionately between the income brackets. Bottom line is, the rich stay rich and their day to day lives are not affected by taxes, and the poor/middle class stay poor/middle class (for the most part) and their lives are affected by taxes as they live paycheck to paycheck...
Looking at just tax rate tables can be misleading because other taxes that aren't income taxes have been added....not saying it's completely invalid measure but illustrating they are getting to pretty much the same place or worse. I'm not saying there isn't room for adjustment in the tax code and loopholes that need to be closed. But there aren't enough taxes for what we are doing. A dollar is taxed on the work you do at the employer level, then up to 39.6% of your income, Then SS is taken out of the first chunk or all of it (I think it should extend to total wages), 43 states have an income tax, $0.183 per gallon federal gas taxes then a higher rate in all but 3 states at the state level, then state and local sales taxes, state and local property taxes, many places have one time taxes like my fav when I was in PA an "occupational privilege tax" where you paid for the privilege of working, then cap gains if you have any, then on the interest of the money your savings earn, then when you die they tax everything you have already paid taxes on.......and we are 34T in debt. You are already working with less than half of what you actually make and I'm not talking at $415K to get you in the top bracket.
If you make 95K in a cheap state like OK you pay 25% to the Feds....another 5% to the state and that's a low one.....if you own a 200K home you pay another 12-1500 to the state or another 1.5ish% percent.....if you drive 10K miles and you get 20 mpg another $200.....so we are 31.2%.....8.63 (OKC local for an example)cents on every dollar you spend if you spend 2500/month there goes another 2.7%....let's call it 34% for easy math....add on 6% for SS and we are at 40%......and we haven't touched all the other ones like taxes applied to communication bills, utility bills, auto registrations, local taxes for your city/county, hotel taxes etc. And we are talking oklahoma not say California where the state can be 12% or Illinois where the gas tax is $0.67/gallon. You get to half your income if you are middle class. Taxes are a necessary part of having a government but we have a spending problem way more than we have a tax problem.
People are already share cropping essentially for the govt we have that doesn't work and spews money it doesn't have. There are people that draw a hard taxation is theft line but I don't think that is most folks.....I think most folks don't mind paying taxes even paying more as they make more.....but if someone is already getting the majority of your money and doing a horrible job with it you don't want to give them any more.
If you make 95K in a cheap state like OK you pay 25% to the Feds....another 5% to the state and that's a low one.....if you own a 200K home you pay another 12-1500 to the state or another 1.5ish% percent.....if you drive 10K miles and you get 20 mpg another $200.....so we are 31.2%.....8.63 (OKC local for an example)cents on every dollar you spend if you spend 2500/month there goes another 2.7%....let's call it 34% for easy math....add on 6% for SS and we are at 40%......and we haven't touched all the other ones like taxes applied to communication bills, utility bills, auto registrations, local taxes for your city/county, hotel taxes etc. And we are talking oklahoma not say California where the state can be 12% or Illinois where the gas tax is $0.67/gallon. You get to half your income if you are middle class. Taxes are a necessary part of having a government but we have a spending problem way more than we have a tax problem.
People are already share cropping essentially for the govt we have that doesn't work and spews money it doesn't have. There are people that draw a hard taxation is theft line but I don't think that is most folks.....I think most folks don't mind paying taxes even paying more as they make more.....but if someone is already getting the majority of your money and doing a horrible job with it you don't want to give them any more.
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Elon Musk paid income taxes for 7 seconds in 2024....after 7 seconds in Jan 1st 2024 he had hit the income tax limit
Zero way to say that is fair. 1% a month would be 100x 7 seconds...just 1%
Massachusetts enacted a 4% rate on millionaires to try to reduce some lunch costs in public school ....after 1 year EVERY kid in the state gets free lunch and they have an excess of money.....on 4%
Zero way to say that is fair. 1% a month would be 100x 7 seconds...just 1%
Massachusetts enacted a 4% rate on millionaires to try to reduce some lunch costs in public school ....after 1 year EVERY kid in the state gets free lunch and they have an excess of money.....on 4%
This post is a decent example of how we need to strike a balance......
So a 4% tax on millionaires doesn't seem unreasonable right....it's just 4% and it's only millionaires.....but I googled Mass % of millionaires and got 9.38% (and that's a big number compared to other states) of Mass folks are millionaires. If you can add 4% to 9.4% of your population and feed every kid including the millionaires kids free school lunches then you were mismanaging your funds all along.
Care to share the stat/fact? My guess is you are confusing unrealized gains as income.
It's amazing to me how the ultra wealthy have convinced about 50% of the country (who are more than likely at, or just above, the poverty level), that making them pay more in taxes is "unfair".
These people are screaming that it's unfair to tax the rich while they are 1 medical emergency away from forclosure and foodstamps.
But sure, hoarding over $100 million dollars in the bank is totally cool because "they earned it".
These people are screaming that it's unfair to tax the rich while they are 1 medical emergency away from forclosure and foodstamps.
But sure, hoarding over $100 million dollars in the bank is totally cool because "they earned it".
PF5
Ranger
itś not that hard to figure out the point Polds4OSU was making...use a calculator and a google machine...
The wealthiest Americans avoid taxes by not earning a salary or a low salary compared to their job/net worth. Elon Musk does not get a salary from Tesla. They make their money in stock then play a game of borrowing against their assets.
The entire system is rigged in their favor.
The entire system is rigged in their favor.
Exactly. And that's what needs to be fixed. You can make the rate 100% if you want but with all the loopholes and deductions they have access to, they can end up paying nothing.
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