Harris 2024 election thread

[Heart Smiles]

I know that Kamala Harris can at times come off looking as silly. It is one of Republicans talking points.
Yet, I see those moments as fluid and unrestrained. When George W. Bush made fun of his own verbal blunders I found it amusing and I did not try to characterize him as a nitwit. The idea that she is dumb is one of the more false narratives that is promoted. The other position that she is flip flopping is also a very narrowly construed idea. The fact that someone can change their position and understand the political and national dynamic is a strength unless it is a deception only in the interest of political gain. I can be against a policy and yet realize that I at various points surrender
in order to accept the authority of multiple entities.

 

[JTOSU]

Heck let's play this game in reverse.

But other than the reason of voting against Harris and Democrats, are there any reasons an independent or moderate Republican would vote FOR "the Devil they know"?

I'd say, no....not really.

It's not like Trump has set forth clear, express policy positions at all.

Although you could not answer the original inquiry, many can easily answer the opposite 1) tax policy; 2) immigration policies; 3) voter id laws; 4) business regulation

That is the issue. There are several items that are easily identifiable to vote FOR Trump for swing voters. Harris needs to articulate that.

 

[mugatu]

Although you could not answer the original inquiry, many can easily answer the opposite 1) tax policy; 2) immigration policies; 3) voter id laws; 4) business regulation

That is the issue. There are several items that are easily identifiable to vote FOR Trump for swing voters. Harris needs to articulate that.

What about those areas are reasons to vote for Trump? You literally said nothing here.

 

[mugatu]

Reasons to vote for Harris with no mention of Trump from here on out. Not in any particular order

1. Comes from Middle Class family and looks to support and grow middle class across the board.
1a. No tax increases for under 400k incomes
1b. Larger child tax credit
1c. Attempting to actively bring down prices of goods - both groceries and medications.
1d. Her proposed tax approach provides the smaller deficit hit while also providing what I see as the larger net gain for working families and least risk to benefits.

2. Comes from law background and appears to support rule of law across the board.
2a. Doesn't appear to want to interject herself in agencies that have traditionally been operating independently from White House.

3. Unfettered support for NATO and other international commitments.

4. Willing to reach across the isle and listen to opposing views - Bringing in a Republican on her cabinet.

5. Attempting to bring down the anger level in the country.

6. Wants to enshrine equal voting rights for all citizens.

7. I feel like she will be level headed and I can trust what she's saying - as much as you can any politician.

 

[Verbal]

What about those areas are reasons to vote for Trump? You literally said nothing here.

Dont bother asking. You’ll never get an honest discussion from JT.

 

[steross]

Did you really want facts or did you just want to play a game and debate. I gave you facts.

I think you are aware, but it doesn't matter what you write, he is gonna respond with what he wants the conversation to be.

 

[cowboyinexile]

Dont bother asking. You’ll never get an honest discussion from JT.

I'm pretty sure she could cure cancer and you would get an argument from him that she is costing jobs in the medical industry.

 

[bubba_]

I'm pretty sure she could cure cancer and you would get an argument from him that she is costing jobs in the medical industry.

that's just anti-cancer. not pro-harris. c'mon, man.

 

[HacklemanPoke]

Although you could not answer the original inquiry, many can easily answer the opposite 1) tax policy; 2) immigration policies; 3) voter id laws; 4) business regulation

That is the issue. There are several items that are easily identifiable to vote FOR Trump for swing voters. Harris needs to articulate that.

You are not paying attention and again cherry picking.

Harris has said she will sign the bipartisan border bill putting 1500 more agents on the line. She has not proposed (1) deporting 20,000,000 people and basically crashing the economy (2) she has not proposed removing current numbers limits on legal immigration which Trump has (3) she has not proposed eliminating the vetting process for certain classes of immigrants which Trump has.

How is he better off on immigration?

You mention continuation of Biden policy. The Biden Admin in 2023 had more new applications for small businesses than at any time in the history of the SBA. His admin has approved more drilling permits on Federal lands than the Trump admin. Oil production has reached an all time high under Biden. Being from the industry and working federal offshore and federal land issues I’m all too familiar w bad regs but I’ve also seen what happens when regs aren’t followed. This happens in every industry. Are you for removing all federal regs?

How is his tax policy better than what she has proposed?

 

[JTOSU]

I'm laughing over here. JT asks for list of reasons to vote FOR Harris. List of policy differences between Harris and Trump is presented. JT responds asking why they aren't reasons to vote for Harris and are instead reasons to vote against Trump.

When you have 2 choices, any difference is both a reason for one and against the other. Come on. You're better than that JT.

Instead of looking at it from a progressive and liberal perspective… think how swing voters may consider a vote for Harris. Right now the election is closely split at 48/46. That means less than 1/2 of people feel Harris is their choice or Trump is their selection.

People know Trump. Those that are voting AGAINST him have probably already made up their mind. He was President for 4-year… a known commodity.

Harris was VP for 4-years, but largely out of the media. Her strategy, so far, has been to keep policies announcements fairly quiet. The strategy has been smart because she let media push her along and create excitement from Dem base. That excitement worked and many more Dems are excited to vote.

However, at some point she is going to need to appeal to swing voters.

 

[cowboyinexile]

that's just anti-cancer. not pro-harris. c'mon, man.

I'm A lIBeRtaRiAn!!!

 

[Polds4OSU]

However, at some point she is going to need to appeal to swing voters.

and if you were intellectually honest you would already know she is doing that and there has been WIDE spread reporting on it. in fact there has been a very nice set of articles on this rise and change in swing state appeal for weeks now as she has climbed back from a 3-5 pt deficit to a even or 3-4 Advantage over the last few states......just in Swing States Alone

You would have noticed it when Trump started calling all the Polls Rigged and Fake....they weren't until this happened.

This was put out YESTERDAY

MSN

Election 2024 Swing State Polls: Harris Leads Or Ties Trump In All Battleground States​

Key Facts​

Harris leads Trump by two percentage points among registered voters combined across Arizona, Georgia, Michigan, Nevada, North Carolina, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin, according to a new Bloomberg News/Morning Consult poll, which surveyed 4,962 registered voters in the states.

Arizona: Harris and Trump are tied, 48% to 48%, according to Bloomberg, marking the candidates’ most tightly contested state—a rare bit of good news the poll delivered the ex-president, who trailed Harris by two points (49% to 47%) in the state in Bloomberg’s July 24-28 survey.


Georgia: Harris leads by two points, 49% to 47%, among registered voters in the Aug. 23-27 poll, after she and Trump were tied with 47% support in the July survey.

Michigan: Harris leads by three points, 49% to 46%, among registered voters in the Bloomberg poll, though that’s a far thinner lead than the 53% to 42% advantage the groups’ July poll found.

Nevada: Harris is up four points, 49% to 45%, according to the poll, building on a two-point (47% to 45%) lead the pollsters found last month.

North Carolina: Harris leads Trump by two points, 49% to 47%, among registered voters, according to Bloomberg/Morning Consult, reversing the 48% to 46% lead Trump held there in July.

Pennsylvania: Harris owns a four-point lead, 51% to 47%, among registered voters in the poll, a flip from the 50% to 46% lead Trump had in the July poll.

Wisconsin: Harris has an eight-point lead, 52% to 44%, among registered voters, significantly expanding the 49% to 47% lead she was found to have last month.

 

[Verbal]

Instead of looking at it from a progressive and liberal perspective… think how swing voters may consider a vote for Harris. Right now the election is closely split at 48/46. That means less than 1/2 of people feel Harris is their choice or Trump is their selection.

People know Trump. Those that are voting AGAINST him have probably already made up their mind. He was President for 4-year… a known commodity.

Harris was VP for 4-years, but largely out of the media. Her strategy, so far, has been to keep policies announcements fairly quiet. The strategy has been smart because she let media push her along and create excitement from Dem base. That excitement worked and many more Dems are excited to vote.

However, at some point she is going to need to appeal to swing voters.

Harris's tax plan will give more money back to the lower and middle and will add far less to the the debt than Trump's plan.

 

[mugatu]

Instead of looking at it from a progressive and liberal perspective… think how swing voters may consider a vote for Harris. Right now the election is closely split at 48/46. That means less than 1/2 of people feel Harris is their choice or Trump is their selection.

People know Trump. Those that are voting AGAINST him have probably already made up their mind. He was President for 4-year… a known commodity.

Harris was VP for 4-years, but largely out of the media. Her strategy, so far, has been to keep policies announcements fairly quiet. The strategy has been smart because she let media push her along and create excitement from Dem base. That excitement worked and many more Dems are excited to vote.

However, at some point she is going to need to appeal to swing voters.

I'm not looking at it from any side in that post. You asked a question, got a very valid answer and then claimed the answer wasn't what you asked for.
Your later responses provided no substance of any sort, they simply stated a few categories with no details why one way or another. You repeatedly fail to acknowledge that this is a 2 person race. Any position that is not in agreement will lead voters to chose one way or the other. Any choice will concurrently be a vote for one candidate concurrently as a vote against the other.

Take this example. If candidate A is going to give me $100 and candidate B is going to take $50. I can say I support A because I'd like to be given $100. I could also say I chose A because B is NOT going to give me $100. See how that's the EXACT SAME THING?

 

[JTOSU]

I'm not looking at it from any side in that post. You asked a question, got a very valid answer and then claimed the answer wasn't what you asked for.
Your later responses provided no substance of any sort, they simply stated a few categories with no details why one way or another. You repeatedly fail to acknowledge that this is a 2 person race. Any position that is not in agreement will lead voters to chose one way or the other. Any choice will concurrently be a vote for one candidate concurrently as a vote against the other.

Take this example. If candidate A is going to give me $100 and candidate B is going to take $50. I can say I support A because I'd like to be given $100. I could also say I chose A because B is NOT going to give me $100. See how that's the EXACT SAME THING?

Respectfully, you are missing my point. The view that Harris has not listed policies are not from an extreme minority. She is behind Trump in the polls with the top two issues that independent and moderate republican feel are most important. IMO, she has to start articulating a message to these swing voters.

Maybe this article the WSJ just posted will help.

The Vice President got away for the most part with repeating her campaign’s platitudes about “the middle class” and “a new way forward” and was never seriously challenged on anything. That’s a shame because the voters still haven’t received a straight answer about whether, and how, she has changed her views from the far-left positions she espoused in 2019 as a presidential candidate.

It’s too much to expect much from a single interview, except that this is the first the Vice President has done as a presidential candidate and she is the least-known candidate in modern history. Ms. Harris remains vulnerable on her past political views, her recent flip-flops, the Biden-Harris record in office, and what appears to be her implicit endorsement of the Biden economic and national-security policies.

These are openings for Donald Trump, assuming he can prosecute the case. But that’s far from a sure thing. The Harris campaign’s bet, and it’s not a crazy one, is that the Vice President can soar to victory on a cloud of general promises, platitudes and “joy.”

The campaign is betting the press won’t care. And they’re betting that Mr. Trump won’t do the homework and doesn’t have the discipline and focus to expose any of this in debate or consistently on the stump. So far it’s been a winning wager.

MSN

 

[Llcoolw]

I know that Kamala Harris can at times come off looking as silly. It is one of Republicans talking points.
Yet, I see those moments as fluid and unrestrained. When George W. Bush made fun of his own verbal blunders I found it amusing and I did not try to characterize him as a nitwit. The idea that she is dumb is one of the more false narratives that is promoted. The other position that she is flip flopping is also a very narrowly construed idea. The fact that someone can change their position and understand the political and national dynamic is a strength unless it is a deception only in the interest of political gain. I can be against a policy and yet realize that I at various points surrender
in order to accept the authority of multiple entities.

 

[cowboyinexile]

Respectfully, you are missing my point. The view that Harris has not listed policies are not from an extreme minority. She is behind Trump in the polls with the top two issues that independent and moderate republican feel are most important. IMO, she has to start articulating a message to these swing voters.

Maybe this article the WSJ just posted will help.

The Vice President got away for the most part with repeating her campaign’s platitudes about “the middle class” and “a new way forward” and was never seriously challenged on anything. That’s a shame because the voters still haven’t received a straight answer about whether, and how, she has changed her views from the far-left positions she espoused in 2019 as a presidential candidate.

It’s too much to expect much from a single interview, except that this is the first the Vice President has done as a presidential candidate and she is the least-known candidate in modern history. Ms. Harris remains vulnerable on her past political views, her recent flip-flops, the Biden-Harris record in office, and what appears to be her implicit endorsement of the Biden economic and national-security policies.

These are openings for Donald Trump, assuming he can prosecute the case. But that’s far from a sure thing. The Harris campaign’s bet, and it’s not a crazy one, is that the Vice President can soar to victory on a cloud of general promises, platitudes and “joy.”

The campaign is betting the press won’t care. And they’re betting that Mr. Trump won’t do the homework and doesn’t have the discipline and focus to expose any of this in debate or consistently on the stump. So far it’s been a winning wager.

MSN

That's an opinion piece. Don't pass it off as real journalism.

 

[mugatu]

Respectfully, you are missing my point. The view that Harris has not listed policies are not from an extreme minority. She is behind Trump in the polls with the top two issues that independent and moderate republican feel are most important. IMO, she has to start articulating a message to these swing voters.

Maybe this article the WSJ just posted will help.

The Vice President got away for the most part with repeating her campaign’s platitudes about “the middle class” and “a new way forward” and was never seriously challenged on anything. That’s a shame because the voters still haven’t received a straight answer about whether, and how, she has changed her views from the far-left positions she espoused in 2019 as a presidential candidate.

It’s too much to expect much from a single interview, except that this is the first the Vice President has done as a presidential candidate and she is the least-known candidate in modern history. Ms. Harris remains vulnerable on her past political views, her recent flip-flops, the Biden-Harris record in office, and what appears to be her implicit endorsement of the Biden economic and national-security policies.

These are openings for Donald Trump, assuming he can prosecute the case. But that’s far from a sure thing. The Harris campaign’s bet, and it’s not a crazy one, is that the Vice President can soar to victory on a cloud of general promises, platitudes and “joy.”

The campaign is betting the press won’t care. And they’re betting that Mr. Trump won’t do the homework and doesn’t have the discipline and focus to expose any of this in debate or consistently on the stump. So far it’s been a winning wager.

MSN

What details are you looking for?

Policies she's stated off the top of my head:

Immigration: bring back the bipartisan bill as previously worked, no mass deportation. Haven't seen it called out but probably going to continue to push for investment in South America to help reduce immigration.

Economy and taxes: fight price gouging in grocery industry, tax deduction for first homebuyers, child tax credit increase, no tax on tips, Medicare price negotiations for all prescriptions, tax increases on wealthy (more details than I'm going to list here but see link at bottom).

Voter rights: pass the John Lewis voter rights act and freedom to vote act

Abortion: push for congressional law to legalize nationally

International: Support NATO and allies without question. Support Ukraine and Isreal - no caveats.

Business and regulations: no bans to fracking, continue pushing for more green energy industry, have not seen called out but expecting to continue pushing for certain industries to return to US (think Chips act), expecting to continue push for climate/environmental protections

That's about as much detail as I remember seeing prior to elections in past years and is a LOT more than Trump had prior to 2016 (remember the repeal ACA but no replacement plan and simplify tax code so you can file on a postcard).

Harris and Trump have competing tax plans. Here's how your paycheck would change under both.

Each presidential candidate is proposing significant changes to the tax code. Here's who would win and lose.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[JTOSU]

What details are you looking for?

Policies she's stated off the top of my head:

Immigration: bring back the bipartisan bill as previously worked, no mass deportation. Haven't seen it called out but probably going to continue to push for investment in South America to help reduce immigration.

Economy and taxes: fight price gouging in grocery industry, tax deduction for first homebuyers, child tax credit increase, no tax on tips, Medicare price negotiations for all prescriptions, tax increases on wealthy (more details than I'm going to list here but see link at bottom).

Voter rights: pass the John Lewis voter rights act and freedom to vote act

Abortion: push for congressional law to legalize nationally

International: Support NATO and allies without question. Support Ukraine and Isreal - no caveats.

Business and regulations: no bans to fracking, continue pushing for more green energy industry, have not seen called out but expecting to continue pushing for certain industries to return to US (think Chips act), expecting to continue push for climate/environmental protections

That's about as much detail as I remember seeing prior to elections in past years and is a LOT more than Trump had prior to 2016 (remember the repeal ACA but no replacement plan and simplify tax code so you can file on a postcard).

Harris and Trump have competing tax plans. Here's how your paycheck would change under both.

Each presidential candidate is proposing significant changes to the tax code. Here's who would win and lose.

www.cbsnews.com

That’s a good list. She needs to start articulating that. She is working on her policy changes with illegal immigration, fracking, eliminating private health insurance, gun buy-back, court packing, etc. She previously advocated some fairly extreme positions on each of those issues. It was understandable because she proposed those ideas during a Dem primary, but she needs to address these. At some point she needs to get those messages out.

This great John Stossel video from two-days ago highlights why it could be difficult for non progressives and non-liberals to understand what Harris stands for.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1828830149095149898

 

[CowboyJD]

I'm laughing over here. JT asks for list of reasons to vote FOR Harris. List of policy differences between Harris and Trump is presented. JT responds asking why they aren't reasons to vote for Harris and are instead reasons to vote against Trump.

When you have 2 choices, any difference is both a reason for one and against the other. Come on. You're better than that JT.

No…he’s really not.

That’s exactly who he is.