Border problem.

[PF5]

Scores are dropping because we keep lowering expectations and getting away from core curriculum

I heard scores were dropping in Oklahoma because of Liberal indoctrination...

 

[Donnyboy]

Typical response: blame teachers and education in general. Parents apparently are perfect in your mind. Just had one convicted of four counts of manslaughter for buying a gun for a minor kid with mental problems. Then he goes to school and kills four classmates. Helicopter parents and participation trophies sure don’t help. Fishing my ass! You haven’t been in schools lately. Electives hardly exist anymore. The truth of the matter is: far too many parents are raising a bunch of routinely lazy, anti authoritarian, crybaby kids whose coddling parents are too ignorant to realize the harm they’re doing to them. Every year the number of kids that will continue to be dependent after graduation will grow because in Momma and Daddy’s eyes their kid can do no wrong. I think you’re not considering migrants kids in your position. Those little boogers have hands made for picking fruits and vegetables. Get those youngsters to clean out the corrals at feed lots. Put them high up in the air roofing. Can’t drive yet, but they’d look good on the back of trash trucks. Don’t you agree Donnyboy? Or is it fishing classes in public schools that you believe to be the problem

Parents are a huge problem.....number of administrators is a bigger one. You also couldn't be more wrong about different electives. Maybe in rural locations the options are limited but for the bulk America the number is several times more now than it was and many kids don't go a full day anymore their senior year. My nephew took fishing in Arkansas' second largest district. It is offered in two high schools that I personally know of that would be ranked 1 and 3 in size if they were in Oklahoma....you know what you do in fishing class, you sit on your phone. So yeah fishing. Less teens work now than ever. That can't be applied to either party it's just the way are society has gone. But lazy, anti authoritarian, crybaby, coddled.....I don't disagree.....maybe because less work now than ever. Maybe a job at the local grocery store would help with that.....

But you missed the point....you claimed the goal was to work kids so test scores go down so they are dumber and thus vote your way. Kids are working less than ever and the scores are down. So the job part doesn't correlate.

 

[Donnyboy]

Republican Led States Are Rolling Back Regulations On Child Labor​

Lawmakers in Republican-led states are proposing and passing legislation to roll back child labor regulations.

In states like Iowa, Missouri, Ohio, and Arkansas, newly passed or pending laws allow companies to hire children without work permits and allow children to work longer hours under more dangerous conditions in places like construction sites, meat packing plants, and automobile factories.

Meanwhile, the Biden administration is struggling to enforce existing federal regulations on child labor.

The Department of Labor reported a 69 percent increase in the number of children, many of them undocumented migrants, employed illegally by companies since 2018.

Republicans attack US child labor laws as violations rise​

As child labor law violations have been on the rise in the US, some state legislators are pushing for changes at state and federal levels to roll back protections in what some see as a threat to return child labor to the country.

The laws aim to expand permissible work hours, broaden the types of jobs young workers are permitted to do, and shield employers from liability for injuries, illnesses or workplace fatalities involving very young workers.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...ckers-sanitation-child-labor-animal-slaughter
Child labor law violations have increased in the US, with a 37% increase in fiscal year 2022, including 688 children working in hazardous conditions, with the number likely much higher as the recorded violations stem from what was found during labor inspections.

The Department of Labor issued a press release in July 2022 noting child labor violations and investigations have increased since 2015.

Several high-profile investigations involving child labor have been exposed over the past year, including the use of child labor in Hyundai and Kia supply chains in Alabama, at JBS meatpacking plants in Nebraska and Minnesota, and at fast-food chains including McDonald’s, Dunkin Donuts and Chipotle.

Amid these increases in child labor violations, legislative efforts have been introduced in several states to roll back child labor protections.

In Iowa, Republican legislators introduced a bill in January to expand the types of work 14- and 15-year-olds would be permitted to do as part of approved training programs, extend allowable work hours, and exempt employers from liability if these young workers are sickened, injured or killed on the job.

“It’s just crazy to me that we are re-litigating a lot of things that seem to have been settled 100, 120 or 140 years ago,” said Charlie Wishman, president of the Iowa AFL-CIO, which is opposing the bill.

Wishman added: “All of these protections have been put in place for a reason. Child labor law is there to make sure that kids are working in age-appropriate work activities or occupations that are appropriate for their age. We think this is a rewrite of our child labor laws in Iowa that are going way, way, way too far and has the potential to put kids in dangerous situations.”


“In my office, we can’t bring in a 12-year-old to make copies, 12 is too young, but we will take that same 12-year-old and put them in a field. The actual law allows them to work unlimited hours as long as school is not in session,” added Maki. “There is basically no protection.”

I'm not advocating child sweat shops or the repeal of child labor laws I'm pointing out the lunacy that the scheme is to repeal laws to lower scores to make kids dumber. Less kids are working and scores are dropping. Working isn't the issue....the issue is our nations schools are in decline....and there is way more than one reason for that. You don't have to have basic reading and math skills to get a diploma in Portland. That isn't either parties agenda.

 

[Pokey]

I heard scores were dropping in Oklahoma because of Liberal indoctrination...

I sure hope you are being sarcastic!

 

[Polds4OSU]

. Less kids are working and scores are dropping.

Where are you getting the stats for 16-19 year olds? Bureau of Labor and Statistics report 16-24 year olds.


In the last 30 years work force age 16-19 peaked out around 32% in 1999 and it's 19% now.


Bureau of Labor and Statistics

Employment and Unemployment Among Youth Summary​

For release 10:00 a.m. (ET) Wednesday, August 16, 2023 USDL-23-1792

Technical information: (202) 691-6378 * cpsinfo@bls.gov * www.bls.gov/cps
Media contact: (202) 691-5902 * PressOffice@bls.gov


EMPLOYMENT AND UNEMPLOYMENT AMONG YOUTH -- SUMMER 2023


In July 2023, 55.0 percent of young people (persons ages 16 to 24) were employed, the U.S.
Bureau of Labor Statistics reported today. This measure was little changed from 55.3 percent
in July 2022. The July 2023 figure remains below its level of 56.2 percent in July 2019,
prior to the onset of the coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic. (The month of July typically is
the summertime peak in youth employment.) The unemployment rate for youth was 8.7 percent
in July 2023, little different than the rates in July 2022 (8.5 percent) and in July 2019
(9.1 percent). (Because this analysis focuses on the seasonal changes in youth employment
and unemployment that occur each spring and summer, the data are not seasonally adjusted.)

Labor Force

The youth labor force--16- to 24-year-olds working or actively looking for work--grows sharply
between April and July each year. During these months, large numbers of high school and college
students search for or take summer jobs, and many graduates enter the labor market to look for
or begin permanent employment. In 2023, the youth labor force grew by 2.2 million, or 10.4
percent, from April (21.5 million) to July (23.7 million). (See table 1.)

The labor force participation rate for all youth was 60.2 percent in July 2023, little different
from a year earlier. (The labor force participation rate is the proportion of the civilian
noninstitutional population that is employed or unemployed. To be classified as unemployed, a
person must either be looking and available for work or on temporary layoff.) (See table 2.)

In 2023, the July labor force participation rate for 16- to 24-year-old men, at 60.4 percent,
was down over the year. The July rate for young women, at 60.0 percent, was little different
from a year earlier. Continuing a long-standing pattern, Whites had the highest youth labor
force participation rate and Asians had the lowest rate (62.6 percent and 49.8 percent,
respectively) in July 2023. The participation rates for Black (53.5 percent) and Asian
(49.8 percent) youth showed little change over the year. After adjusting for population
controls, the participation rates for White (62.6 percent) and Hispanic (57.5 percent) youth
also showed little change over the year.

Employment

In July 2023, there were 21.6 million employed 16- to 24-year-olds. Between April and July 2023, the
number of employed youth rose by 1.4 million, or 6.9 percent. The employment-population ratio for youth--the proportion of the 16- to 24-year-old civilian noninstitutional population with a job--was 55.0 percent in July 2023, little changed from the prior year. (See tables 1 and 2.)

In July 2023, the employment-population ratios for young men (54.9 percent) and Blacks
(43.8 percent) were lower than they were a year earlier. The ratios for young women (55.1 percent), Asians (47.0 percent), and Hispanics (51.5 percent) were little changed.

In July 2023, 25 percent (5.3 million) of employed 16- to 24-year-olds worked in the leisure and
hospitality industry, the largest share of youth workers. An additional 18 percent of employed
youth worked in the retail trade industry, and 13 percent worked in education and health services.
(See table 3.)

Unemployment

Typically, the number of unemployed young people increases with the onset of summer, as people
who were not in the labor force while attending school begin seeking employment. Unemployment
among youth rose by 826,000 from April to July 2023. About 7 in 10 of the unemployed youth were
looking for full-time work in July 2023, little different from the prior year.
(See tables 1 and 2.)

The youth unemployment rate, at 8.7 percent in July 2023, was little changed from July 2022.
The July 2023 unemployment rate was lower for young Asians (5.6 percent) than in the prior summer,
while the rates for young men (9.2 percent), women (8.2 percent), Whites (7.0 percent), Blacks
(18.0 percent), and Hispanics (10.5 percent) showed little or no change.

 

[Pokey]

Parents are a huge problem.....number of administrators is a bigger one. You also couldn't be more wrong about different electives. Maybe in rural locations the options are limited but for the bulk America the number is several times more now than it was and most kids don't go a full day anymore their senior year. My nephew took fishing in Arkansas' second largest district. It is offered in two high schools that I personally know of that would be ranked 1 and 3 in size if they were in Oklahoma....you know what you do in fishing class, you sit on your phone. So yeah fishing. Less teens work now than ever. That can't be applied to either party it's just the way are society has gone. But lazy, anti authoritarian, crybaby, coddled.....I don't disagree.....maybe because less work now than ever. Maybe a job at the local grocery store would help with that.....

But you missed the point....you claimed the goal was to work kids so test scores go down so they are dumber and thus vote your way. Kids are working less than ever and the scores are down. So the job part doesn't correlate.

I’m not the one pretending too many administrators are the problem, and near universal fishing classes are being offered instead of STEM. No more art, music, band in some places, shop, personal finance,etc. all gone for the sake of core curriculum. As a former teacher I swear kids without adequate sleep, whether working or playing on social media all night are lethargic masses of flesh unprepared for learning. But their $7.25 minimum wage jobs will be greatly appreciated by Mom and Pop shops to corporate CEOs. By the way, the GOP and Trump LOVE the uneducated. This just has to be good for Republicans. How many adults could you replace with children in your corporation?

 

[Donnyboy]

Where are you getting the stats for 16-19 year olds? Bureau of Labor and Statistics report 16-24 year olds.


In the last 30 years work force age 16-19 peaked out around 32% in 1999 and it's 19% now.


Bureau of Labor and Statistics

Employment and Unemployment Among Youth Summary​

For release 10:00 a.m. (ET) Wednesday, August 16, 2023 USDL-23-1792

Technical information: (202) 691-6378 * cpsinfo@bls.gov * www.bls.gov/cps
Media contact: (202) 691-5902 * PressOffice@bls.gov


EMPLOYMENT AND UNEMPLOYMENT AMONG YOUTH -- SUMMER 2023


In July 2023, 55.0 percent of young people (persons ages 16 to 24) were employed, the U.S.
Bureau of Labor Statistics reported today. This measure was little changed from 55.3 percent
in July 2022. The July 2023 figure remains below its level of 56.2 percent in July 2019,
prior to the onset of the coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic. (The month of July typically is
the summertime peak in youth employment.) The unemployment rate for youth was 8.7 percent
in July 2023, little different than the rates in July 2022 (8.5 percent) and in July 2019
(9.1 percent). (Because this analysis focuses on the seasonal changes in youth employment
and unemployment that occur each spring and summer, the data are not seasonally adjusted.)

Labor Force

The youth labor force--16- to 24-year-olds working or actively looking for work--grows sharply
between April and July each year. During these months, large numbers of high school and college
students search for or take summer jobs, and many graduates enter the labor market to look for
or begin permanent employment. In 2023, the youth labor force grew by 2.2 million, or 10.4
percent, from April (21.5 million) to July (23.7 million). (See table 1.)

The labor force participation rate for all youth was 60.2 percent in July 2023, little different
from a year earlier. (The labor force participation rate is the proportion of the civilian
noninstitutional population that is employed or unemployed. To be classified as unemployed, a
person must either be looking and available for work or on temporary layoff.) (See table 2.)

In 2023, the July labor force participation rate for 16- to 24-year-old men, at 60.4 percent,
was down over the year. The July rate for young women, at 60.0 percent, was little different
from a year earlier. Continuing a long-standing pattern, Whites had the highest youth labor
force participation rate and Asians had the lowest rate (62.6 percent and 49.8 percent,
respectively) in July 2023. The participation rates for Black (53.5 percent) and Asian
(49.8 percent) youth showed little change over the year. After adjusting for population
controls, the participation rates for White (62.6 percent) and Hispanic (57.5 percent) youth
also showed little change over the year.

Employment

In July 2023, there were 21.6 million employed 16- to 24-year-olds. Between April and July 2023, the
number of employed youth rose by 1.4 million, or 6.9 percent. The employment-population ratio for youth--the proportion of the 16- to 24-year-old civilian noninstitutional population with a job--was 55.0 percent in July 2023, little changed from the prior year. (See tables 1 and 2.)

In July 2023, the employment-population ratios for young men (54.9 percent) and Blacks
(43.8 percent) were lower than they were a year earlier. The ratios for young women (55.1 percent), Asians (47.0 percent), and Hispanics (51.5 percent) were little changed.

In July 2023, 25 percent (5.3 million) of employed 16- to 24-year-olds worked in the leisure and
hospitality industry, the largest share of youth workers. An additional 18 percent of employed
youth worked in the retail trade industry, and 13 percent worked in education and health services.
(See table 3.)

Unemployment

Typically, the number of unemployed young people increases with the onset of summer, as people
who were not in the labor force while attending school begin seeking employment. Unemployment
among youth rose by 826,000 from April to July 2023. About 7 in 10 of the unemployed youth were
looking for full-time work in July 2023, little different from the prior year.
(See tables 1 and 2.)

The youth unemployment rate, at 8.7 percent in July 2023, was little changed from July 2022.
The July 2023 unemployment rate was lower for young Asians (5.6 percent) than in the prior summer,
while the rates for young men (9.2 percent), women (8.2 percent), Whites (7.0 percent), Blacks
(18.0 percent), and Hispanics (10.5 percent) showed little or no change.

Here:

U.S. teens (16-19) enrolled in school and working 1985-2022 | Statista

In 2022, around 20.3 percent of teenagers between ages 16 and 19 were employees while enrolled at school in the United States.

www.statista.com

I have 4 kids in my life that fall in that category. Zero of them or their friends work during the school year....that covers multiple races and rich folks to poor folks. About half during the summer but none during school.

 

[Donnyboy]

I’m not the one pretending too many administrators are the problem, and near universal fishing classes are being offered instead of STEM. No more art, music, band in some places, shop, personal finance,etc. all gone for the sake of core curriculum. As a former teacher I swear kids without adequate sleep, whether working or playing on social media all night are lethargic masses of flesh unprepared for learning. But their $7.25 minimum wage jobs will be greatly appreciated by Mom and Pop shops to corporate CEOs. By the way, the GOP and Trump LOVE the uneducated. This just has to be good for Republicans. How many adults could you replace with children in your corporation?

Maybe it's part of the problem.......

How many adults could you replace with children in your corporation? Zero unless they had more STEM than is offered.

 

[JTOSU]

View attachment 3499

Maybe it's part of the problem.......

And it’s an even much larger problem in Oklahoma. Over 500 Superintendents in Oklahoma.

 

[Polds4OSU]

Here:

U.S. teens (16-19) enrolled in school and working 1985-2022 | Statista

In 2022, around 20.3 percent of teenagers between ages 16 and 19 were employees while enrolled at school in the United States.

www.statista.com

I have 4 kids in my life that fall in that category. Zero of them or their friends work during the school year....that covers multiple races and rich folks to poor folks. About half during the summer but none during school.

Those stats cut off in 2021.....just be aware the labor force of Gen Z in school is making a strong comeback both PRE and POST COVID and is almost back up to 35%

Millennials took a dive as an entire generation..your seeing Gen Z head back to "normal" but every generation from silent to Gen X was 40-50% and headed back that way ....could it be this was a Millennial generational issue that Gen Z is in the process of correcting the curve?

 

[CowboyJD]

Doesn't the GOP want more children for more workforce in the future? Lots of people are concerned with reduced birth rate and impacts of that on future society. Immigration is one easy way to offset that.

Only the "right kind" of children I'm pretty sure.

And I won't put that on the entire GOP. I'm speaking mostly of the MAGA wing of the party.

 

[Donnyboy]

Those stats cut off in 2021.....just be aware the labor force of Gen Z in school is making a strong comeback both PRE and POST COVID and is almost back up to 35%

Millennials took a dive as an entire generation..your seeing Gen Z head back to "normal" but every generation from silent to Gen X was 40-50% and headed back that way ....could it be this was a Millennial generational issue that Gen Z is in the process of correcting the curve?

View attachment 3500

I know we are derailing the thread here but I think the drop in working students at the high school level has little if anything to do with anything political and more to do with the demand extra curriculars put on kids now which I oppose. I have a senior in band and jr in FB. You could work and play football but it would be tough in the bigger schools which make up the bulk of kids.....there is no way you could and be in the big competing bands in the fall and work. From July-Nov they practice 90 minutes after school every day, march for 3 hours one day a week, and make kids also do symphonic/jazz/concert band so they can have sectionals and bypass practice limits for an individual activity....play at a game on Friday.....then 3 hours on Saturday. During the 6 weeks of marching competitions it's compete Wed, FB game Fri, compete in an open Saturday. FB goes from Aug to Nov/Dec and 7 on 7 starts in Jan......and neither of those have the schedule that young ladies have that do volleyball where they "can't make you" but it is all but required to play club ball so you travel to tourneys on weekends. Baseball and softball are similar but from my experience, anecdotal as it is, volleyball is the biggest time demand of all. Look at the change in cheerleading....used to be you cheered at games....now it's tumbling once a week and dance and competing clubs. Is it better for the kids....time will tell but I know it takes up a crap ton more time than it used to.

 

[Polds4OSU]

I know we are derailing the thread here but I think the drop in working students at the high school level has little if anything to do with anything political and more to do with the demand extra curriculars put on kids now which I oppose. I have a senior in band and jr in FB. You could work and play football but it would be tough in the bigger schools which make up the bulk of kids.....there is no way you could and be in the big competing bands in the fall and work. From July-Nov they practice 90 minutes after school every day, march for 3 hours one day a week, and make kids also do symphonic/jazz/concert band so they can have sectionals and bypass practice limits for an individual activity....play at a game on Friday.....then 3 hours on Saturday. During the 6 weeks of marching competitions it's compete Wed, FB game Fri, compete in an open Saturday. FB goes from Aug to Nov/Dec and 7 on 7 starts in Jan......and neither of those have the schedule that young ladies have that do volleyball where you the "can't make you" but it is all but required to play club ball so you travel to tourneys on weekends. Baseball and softball are similar but from my experience, anecdotal as it is, volleyball is the biggest time demand of all.

My kids have graduated, but they were both in one of the largest and most competitive bands in Oklahoma and competed all over the US and in Europe. It was IMPOSSIBLE for them to have a job and do competitive marching band. However, they did have the option to just do Non Competitive band if they truly wanted to do band and Work. It was a choice they had to make.

What you are listing like playing club ball etc. Many of Oklahoma High School sports teams have started this type of stuff. It isn't the school that is doing it...it is the side business of outside organizations that have built up into Multi State and Multi Million $$ businesses poaching these kids and squeezing some extra $$ out of their parents in the mean time. BOA was not required but if you didn't go full on Comp Band to participate in BOA National Competitions you just couldn't do Comp band at all and were free to take a job if you wanted to after school.

Anyway.. my 2 cents. Back to Bordering Now

 

[Polds4OSU]

'It's Exactly The Opposite!' Fox Host Shuts Down Nancy Mace For Border Bill Lies​

Congresswoman Nancy Mace (R-SC) thought she was heading into friendly territory when she appeared on Fox News Monday afternoon to voice her opposition to the bipartisan border deal.

The deal, which would be one of the strongest pieces of border legislation in history if passed, has faced headwinds from extreme Republicans who want to see it fail in order to help Donald Trump’s chances in the 2024 election. You don’t have to believe us that this is their plan. They’re saying it out loud.

On Fox, Mace tried to claim that the bill “waters down” asylum laws and “keeps the border wide open.” Host Martha MacCallum instantly shut down her lies and got Mace to admit that she hadn't even read the full bill.

Mace: Well, I find it very ironic, Senator Lankford’s comments there, because this bill keeps the border wide open. There are so many loopholes in this bill, it it'll make your head spin. And any Republican that supports it, supports open borders, because it's going to allow Secretary Mayorkas to have full discretion on who comes in above that 5,000 limit. It lowers the standard for those that are seeking asylum. And look, the American people are tired of being an ATM machine for the illegal aliens that are coming across our border every single day. And the more that I read the language in this bill, the more frustrated I get with it, because it's not what we’re being sold.
MacCallum: I think we're all trying to figure out this bill. Have you read all 370 pages of this bill?
Mace: We are working through it. We have about 50 pages more to go. But from what we can tell and I'm going to put forth a statement once we finish reading the bill, the measures that we feel are extremely undesirable that keep our border open, that water down the asylum system. It's not good for the country.
MacCallum: It’s exactly the opposite! That's why I'm asking, you know, and obviously Senator Lankford and his colleagues worked hard to negotiate something. You know, it's hard to do some actual negotiation. And they say no new asylum claims would be allowed. Anybody crossing would be removed…
(Mace interrupts)
MacCallum: Hold on. And he said, you know, this it ends the whole idea of I made it to U.S. soil and now you have to process me. It increases detention beds, doubles the deportation flights and adds $650 million to expand the border wall, which is the same language and funding that's in H.R. 2. So, you know, isn't isn't getting something better than getting nothing because this problem isn't going away.

MacCallum’s posture is far different than other hosts on the right wing network. Host Laura Ingraham has been using her show to try to bully House Republicans into trashing the border deal, warning them that Donald Trump does not want it to pass and deceptively framing the contents of the bill.

Now, the Republican Party is now facing new headwinds following an endorsement of the bill by the Border Patrol Union, who is urging its "quick passage."

At this point, the bill is seeing broad support from Senate Republican leadership, many House Republicans, Senate Democrats, House Democrats, President Biden, the Border Patrol Union and the Chamber of Commerce, leaving the malignant MAGA movement remains the only roadblock to progress. Will MAGA choose the United States or Trump?

 

[Pokey]

View attachment 3499

Maybe it's part of the problem.......

How many adults could you replace with children in your corporation? Zero unless they had more STEM than is offered.

There are far too many administrators. That said that number has little to nothing to do with solving the problems associated with children working in industry and the GOP working to overturn child labor laws. 12-15 year olds will soon be available in the job market. So I guess you are one of those parents that fights to keep band and athletics instead of more STEM? Got it !

 

[Donnyboy]

There are far too many administrators. That said that number has little to nothing to do with solving the problems associated with children working in industry and the GOP working to overturn child labor laws. 12-15 year olds will soon be available in the job market. So I guess you are one of those parents that fights to keep band and athletics instead of more STEM? Got it !

Exactly what I'm saying....America needs more 12 year olds in factories, more football, and less math. That's exactly what I'm saying.

 

[steross]

Let’s keep this simple and just focus of cost of K-12 education which dwarfs the SS benefit. I am unclear why you are oddly wanting to play ignorant on cost of illegal immigration.

~4M children of illegal immigrants in K-12 schools. Average per pupil spend for K-12 in US is $16k/annually according to Dept of Edu.
I never said anything about not wanting to educate kids, but there is still a cost of illegal immigration to the tune of +$60B every year.

And FYI - ACP is not defunct. Just not funded past next year. It will pay billions this year. And yes, taxpayers pay for it. And it is $75 per HH per month where I live.

I don't want simple. I want reality. You claimed they get a list of things. Name. The. Programs.

Too simple is not helpful. They don't live in the school. If you are going to call them an expense, what pays for school? Property tax. And who pays property tax? Real estate owners. And where do they get that money? From rent.

So, if you want to tell us what their schooling costs us, you are going to have to account for the property tax they pay through rent (or property). Or, are you saying they live for free from one of the programs that you can't mention?

The last day to sign up for ACP is tomorrow. So, not quite defunct. But, expected to run out by April. Is that really the BEST example you've got?

Honestly, I could do a better job defending your side than you are.

 

[Pokey]

Exactly what I'm saying....America needs more 12 year olds in factories, more football, and less math. That's exactly what I'm saying.

Sounds like a Republican platform. Blame everyone else but yourself and family. Band and athletics is more important to most parents and students than Stem. Possibly it’s the only fun thing left. But let’s steal more of their childhood by putting those poor and unpampered kids to work. Those border crossings parents and kids are welcome to pick our fruit and do the other jobs Mericans won’t do, while your kids enjoy the thrills of competition, participation trophies, and hovering parents fulfilling their every need and desire. I had a parent complaining that her child just would not mind her, in spite of taking away his TV, Stereo, Phone, allowance, and car. Truthfully it was easier teaching gangsters than spoiled brats.

 

[Polds4OSU]

Sounds like a Republican platform. Blame everyone else but yourself and family. Band and athletics is more important to most parents and students than Stem. Possibly it’s the only fun thing left. But let’s steal more of their childhood by putting those poor and unpampered kids to work. Those border crossings parents and kids are welcome to pick our fruit and do the other jobs Mericans won’t do, while your kids enjoy the thrills of competition, participation trophies, and hovering parents fulfilling their every need and desire. I had a parent complaining that her child just would not mind her, in spite of taking away his TV, Stereo, Phone, allowance, and car. Truthfully it was easier teaching gangsters than spoiled brats.

I once witnessed 8 mothers sit together in a church pew and do their kids math homework using a teacher's edition of the text book and discuss how they had to do it so their kids could keep up with all the baseball for both school and traveling competition teams . Priorities are completely way off base for a large group of parents

 

[JTOSU]

Honestly, I could do a better job defending your side than you are.

I gave you actual $60B in spend. You have provided not even a “nebulous” SS dollar amount benefit. The $13B benefit came from me.

If you want to honestly debate. I’m in. But appears you want to live in a world that illegal immigrants don’t have a cost, so I am out.