Exactly. So, what have you seen that tells you what he is seeing pre-snap? Because what I see is that everything breaks down at the snap.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sunday Morning Coaches Week 4: Stranded in Iowa edition
- Thread starter RxCowboy
- Start date
- Status
Exactly. So, what have you seen that tells you what he is seeing pre-snap? Because what I see is that everything breaks down at the snap.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Herecomesbullet
New member
That's 100% of the data on OSU's head coaches going back over 40 years.
My point is that our HISTORY won't dictate anything going forward. I honestly don't think past coaching moves impact 2023 and beyond. Nobody cares about Jimmy Johnson or even Les Miles at this point.
If you want to talk about things that WILL impact our future, then of course NIL and re-alignment enter the discussion. We have some pretty hard natural limitations until/unless a mega donor comes along randomly, and would agree that we could easily fall to a middle tier or minor league of sorts. If that happens, I think the golden goose is dead, and the sport will implode in a lot of ways, which at that point you're dealing with much different problems...
Soothsayer
New member
It seems very likely that the big dogs (schools like Bama, Georgia, Ohio St., Texas, OU, LSU, USC, and probably Colorado while Deion is there) will be able to steal away good players from programs like OSU, KSU, Tech, etc. However, there is probably still room for OSU and KSU and the like to draw players away from Tulsa, North Texas, New Mexico, etc. Those kinds of players who are pretty good, but not quite good enough to go to USC or LSU and won't get big NLI offers. That's kind of what OSU has done with high school kids for years now. I don't know if Gundy is the guy who can do it, though.
The world of college football is changing and that will change all of college athletics, too. I don't like it, but I don't know if there's anything that can be done to stop what's already been put in motion. There are two things that can somewhat mitigate what's going on: 1) put a limit on transfers. You get one freebie. After that it costs you a year of eligibility and you have to sit for one year. 2) Prevent schools from just handing out NLI money. Make it so there has to be some actual use of the name, image, or likeness instead of just handing cash (e.g. an athlete needs to actual appear in a car dealer commercial). Those might help some, but the cows are already out of the barn.
The world of college football is changing and that will change all of college athletics, too. I don't like it, but I don't know if there's anything that can be done to stop what's already been put in motion. There are two things that can somewhat mitigate what's going on: 1) put a limit on transfers. You get one freebie. After that it costs you a year of eligibility and you have to sit for one year. 2) Prevent schools from just handing out NLI money. Make it so there has to be some actual use of the name, image, or likeness instead of just handing cash (e.g. an athlete needs to actual appear in a car dealer commercial). Those might help some, but the cows are already out of the barn.
There will be a lot of new cases like this. Schools like Rice, Tulane, or even Tulsa could have deeper pockets than us, and it'll be interesting to see how it starts to skew things. There will be some schools that have been really good on the field that may actually get blown out on the NIL side, and may not be able to compete in that realm assuming TV revenue and conference $$$ can't contribute to such funds (directly).
He gets everyone lined up properly, on time, makes checks, confident demeanor, no delay of game, hands aren't shaking, etc.
But again, none of that matters if he can't handle the real game pressure once the ball is snapped.
I don't know that we have the donor base to be able to do that. Like it or not we are a small market program. That is really the point in talking about our history. There is a reason why the program 77 miles to the south has been the blue blood and we haven't been, they have had the money and we haven't. I just can't see the state of Oklahoma ever having the kind of support that it takes to sustain two blue blood programs. It just isn't ever going to happen and people who think it can are unrealistic. I'm not even sure that uO can sustain it in this new NIL world and in the conference they are moving into. We'll see. I think the absolute best thing for us about realignment is that Texass has gotten out of the conference and away from us before they finally found someone who could take advantage of their nearly limitless resources, which they may finally have.
Still cherry picking. Still disproves your point rather than proving. Our coaches leaving OSU and going to bigger jobs is the exception, not the rule.
Herecomesbullet
New member
Bless your heart Rx
Is that Southern for "I dont have a valid response"?
Herecomesbullet
New member
No...It's language for, this has all been covered already. But, again, it shows that 50% of our Head Football coaches, before Mike Gundy, dating back OVER 40 years, have left OSU for bigger/better programs, and that providing 100% of the data on our head coaches going back over 40 years is not cherry picking, it's historical fact that dates back a long, long time. It's also 44 years of context that, in turn, has become one of the many reasons why our fan base has an inferiority complex that needs to be flushed from the fan base. I understand why many of our fans feel this way, but OSU has to move on from this line of thinking because the College landscape is changing by the second, and has changed immensely since the period in history that has led our fans having such an inferior way of thinking. And, also as previously mentioned, schools like OSU, KState, Iowa State, aren't losing Head coaches to the bigger/better programs like they used to, which was also previously mentioned in my post on the SEC coaches.
Last edited:
You REALLY need to drop K-State from the argument...I honestly don't see how any of your examples or ratios are supporting what you think you are arguing.
Herecomesbullet
New member
You are arguing just to argue at this point. Everything has already been posted and explained to show the contrary to your statement. No need to rehash.
No, I'm not. K-State, prior to Bill Snyder, had only achieved >6 wins a grand total of 11 times in its history. And most of those were pre-WWII when teams only played 7-8 games. Bill Snyder is K-States' "Mike Gundy". Do you know what happened when Snyder retired? Using KState as evidence that coaches are not hired away to better gigs is pure idiocy. They did not have coaches worthy until Snyder and he wasn't going anywhere...when he did go...the team plummeted and they had to bring Snyder back to right the ship. Kleiman has struggled a bit...had a good season last year, but I reckon if he is successful this year...Kleiman may see offers.
Herecomesbullet
New member
Right, and all of which you just posted I assume is 100% correct, but isn't a rebuttal to the point being made.
Places "like" "OSU, Iowa State and KState" Meaning schools of their stature that aren't blue bloods that folks have historically considered to be stepping stone type schools.
Meaning, schools of their stature
Your statements have shown you to be an advocate of these places being stepping stones, including KState, based on your comments about Klieman.
I have shown evidence, the SEC coaches and where they came from, to show the contrary.
Your statement, in and of itself, exactly goes to the point that was made, and you specifically used KState, the school you claimed would be idiocy to use as an example.
Last edited:
PokitN
New member
Guys, we would be a MUCH better football team if we had: John Paul Richardson, Trace Ford, Mason Cobb, Braylin Presley, Bryson Green, Stephon Johnson & Spencer Sanders. I'm not saying we'd win the Big 12, but I do think we'd currently be undefeated w/ those guys back.
In just Wide Recievers alone we lost:
Gundy doesn't want to "recruit players twice" Well I'm sorry dude, but this is the game now. You have to create an atmosphere that doesn't just attract talent but keeps it. Either evolve or die Gundy.
Please show me where Kansas State has EVER lost a head coach to a better program. Before Snyder they were the worst program in FBS/D1A. Go ahead, I will wait.
Iowa State has an all time winning percentage of 0.456 and is 112 of 131 in FBS. Not going to look through their head coach history, but I’m willing to bet their promotion of head coaches to better programs is even more rare in their history than it is in ours. Because they have historically been awful.
And yes, you are cherry picking, that’s why you want to limit the data set you look at rather than looking at the larger picture. That is exactly what cherry picking is, limiting the data set to favor your argument when your argument crumbles by looking at the entirety of the data. Which makes you a cherry picker.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Its idiotic to use KState because they have no history...period. They are a statistical outlier...as in...not on the far end of the tail of the curve...ISU is not far behind...
You need data (schools) with similar geographic & economic market issues that actually have a history of success on the field and in keeping (or losing) successful coaches to make this argument...good luck in that search beyond the column marked "blue bloods"
Herecomesbullet
New member
Bless your heart Rx
- Status
