ICE

Leavitt: “The deadly incident that took place in Minnesota yesterday occurred as a result of a larger, sinister left-wing movement that has spread across our country, where our brave men and women of federal law enforcement are under organized attack.”

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The Bulwark (@bulwarkonline) on Threads

Leavitt: “The deadly incident that took place in Minnesota yesterday occurred as a result of a larger, sinister left-wing movement that has spread across our country, where our brave men and women of federal law enforcement are under organized attack.”
www.threads.com www.threads.com
 
"We are calling on ICE to halt all operations in Portland until a full and independent investigation can take place.”

Portland Mayor Keith Wilson speaks after U.S. Customs and Border Patrol agents shot and injured two people.

www.ms.now

Federal agent shoots 2 in Oregon, further raising tensions over national immigration actions

The Department of Homeland Security suggested agents were tracking a member of a Venezuelan prostitution ring when the shooting occurred.
www.ms.now www.ms.now
 
osuwhit said:
I think she put herself in a stupid position and tried leaving without the intent to harm any of the ICE officers. Unfortunately, the ICE officer felt justification in firing 3 times at point blank range because she drove extremely close to him.

Before the pistol was fired, would anyone here feel safe putting yourself in that same situation?

It’s stupid games, stupid prizes. These people get to kick your ass, pepper spray you, shoot you with rubber, or real bullets if they feel you are a lethal threat.

She was her son’s last parent. She was shot at 9:30am and probably just dropped him off at school about an hour before her life was taken and she’s out they’re taking incredibly stupid risks in a fight she anyone else can’t ever ever ever win. She let her son down and it’s incredibly sad.

My eyes tell me the officer didn’t have to fire. Best case scenario for ICE, they arrest her. Worst case, she drives off and is no longer obstructing their work. He couldn’t handle the worst case and made it catastrophic. He’ll probably walk free too.
Click to expand...
For now this is where I will differ with you.

We don’t know her motivation. We don’t know if she was scared. Maybe she panicked. There is video where she wasn’t blocking anyone as cars were passing in front of her. Witnesses say she was told by LEOs to leave. She’s a 37 yo mom and guys w guns and masks are screaming and rushing her vehicle.

I don’t know if she let her son down. I know who is definitely at fault here.
 
HacklemanPoke said:
For now this is where I will differ with you.

We don’t know her motivation. We don’t know if she was scared. Maybe she panicked. There is video where she wasn’t blocking anyone as cars were passing in front of her. Witnesses say she was told by LEOs to leave. She’s a 37 yo mom and guys w guns and masks are screaming and rushing her vehicle.

I don’t know if she let her son down. I know who is definitely at fault here.
Click to expand...

I’m under the impression she was there to purposefully and strategically interfere. Her vehicle is parked perpendicular.

I think she decided to bail on interfering any further and was wrongfully killed.

I can accept being wrong about her intentions on being there but I think it’s clear she didn’t accidentally find herself in the wrong place at the wrong time.
 
These ICE raids created a tinderbox and something like this would inevitably happen. The current administration knew this and was not surprised. They will leverage this to further their agenda. This will likely escalate and they will not back down. They will use it all as justification to do more and more.

Obviously, they are convinced that nothing can impede their efforts and there will be no serious investigation into the responsibility of LEOs to PROTECT and serve. Just like the military, their viewpoint is that proper rules of engagement are unnecessary restrictions that hamper their forces from fulfilling the administration’s wishes.

I believe this is just the beginning.
 
osuwhit said:
I’m under the impression she was there to purposefully and strategically interfere. Her vehicle is parked perpendicular.

I think she decided to bail on interfering any further and was wrongfully killed.

I can accept being wrong about her intentions on being there but I think it’s clear she didn’t accidentally find herself in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Click to expand...
She may very well have been there not in support of ice. I don’t know. If she was then maybe someone will come forward w texts or her social media will show.

But what gives you your current impression?
 
osuwhit said:
I think she put herself in a stupid position and tried leaving without the intent to harm any of the ICE officers. Unfortunately, the ICE officer felt justification in firing 3 times at point blank range because she drove extremely close to him.

Before the pistol was fired, would anyone here feel safe putting yourself in that same situation?

It’s stupid games, stupid prizes. These people get to kick your ass, pepper spray you, shoot you with rubber, or real bullets if they feel you are a lethal threat.

She was her son’s last parent. She was shot at 9:30am and probably just dropped him off at school about an hour before her life was taken and she’s out they’re taking incredibly stupid risks in a fight she anyone else can’t ever ever ever win. She let her son down and it’s incredibly sad.

My eyes tell me the officer didn’t have to fire. Best case scenario for ICE, they arrest her. Worst case, she drives off and is no longer obstructing their work. He couldn’t handle the worst case and made it catastrophic. He’ll probably walk free too.
Click to expand...

I unfortunately agree that the woman deciding to protest that day and deciding to try to leave at that point was a stupid move for an American citizen. We have seen that our government has hired cut rate thugs who are nothing like the real federal agents that we have dealt with all our lives. We have seen them already holding guns like gangbangers, not police. We have seen them violate our rights with no repercussion at all. And we have seen this big government oppression lauded by the very people that used to fear a big government state. She misjudged the reality: under an authoritarian system, the old assumptions about protest and freedom no longer apply.

But, the bigger mistake is not her, but all of us. We are the ones playing the stupid games and winning the stupid prizes. History is littered with megalomaniac leaders who exploit fear and weakness, convincing people to excuse lost freedoms, violence, and cruelty in the name of power and “greatness.”

For 250 years or so, we were better than that. We cherished the nation our forefathers built above any one person. Sure, we've had presidents we liked, but never before did a significant portion of the population put the person and his goals and plans above the nation. That is over. We now have people that care nothing about America and care only about Trump-America. And if you think America and Trump-America are the same thing, you just are not paying attention.
 
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osuwhit said:
I’m under the impression she was there to purposefully and strategically interfere. Her vehicle is parked perpendicular.
Click to expand...
The NYT video analysis above clearly shows that she was not parked but was trying to pull out to the left when other vehicles stopped her from being able to do so. She was then waving others forward in a polite manner. She was not parked.
 
Trump’s regime will end at some point. He won’t live forever and his legal term in office will expire. I have agreed with a lot of his policies and while ICE is a good concept, its implementation has been a clusterf#*%k. The Office of Professional Responsibility (OPR) needs to be scrapped.
 
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CptnQuirk said:
Trump’s regime will end at some point. He won’t live forever and his legal term in office will expire. I have agreed with a lot of his policies and while ICE is a good concept, its implementation has been a clusterf#*%k. It needs to be scrapped.
Click to expand...
Sorry to Godwin this thread, if you had been in 1930s Germany, or in 1980s Iraq with Saddam tackling Iran with the backing of the US, do you think you would have disagreed with every policy?

Policy arguments were Trump's first term. This goes far beyond policy.

Obviously at 80 something years old, Trump's regime will end. But, will it end with America or will it end with Trump-America in place? Again, if you feel confident in the answer, you are not paying attention.
 
steross said:
Sorry to Godwin this thread, if you had been in 1930s Germany, or in 1980s Iraq with Saddam tackling Iran with the backing of the US, do you think you would have disagreed with every policy?

Policy arguments were Trump's first term. This goes far beyond policy.

Obviously at 80 something years old, Trump's regime will end. But, will it end with America or will it end with Trump-America in place? Again, if you feel confident in the answer, you are not paying attention.
Click to expand...
As I said, in response to your comment about policy, it’s the implementation that needs to be called into question. As I edited above, the Office of Professional Responsibility (OPR) needs to be scrapped, or better yet, made to do its job.
 
I just saw on CBS that Ross, the shooter, was dragged by a car a few months ago and as a result he had 38 stitches. A government official says that may have made him more sensitive to thinking he might be targeted by a vehicle. If that is the case then WHY THE HELL IS HE STILL DOING THAT JOB. He should have been reassigned. Now he needs to go to prison, IMO.
 
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